Where are they?

[Garraty_47]

I thought for sure someone here would Share a clip or three of the news about AOC getting dragged by essentially everyone over her vote on MTG's bill. I mean AOC's reaction to all the pushback has been hilarious in and of itself.

Are we simply not caring about anything that isn't directly Trump-related?

How boring.

 

[jack]

I thought for sure someone here would Share a clip or three of the news about AOC getting dragged by essentially everyone over her vote on MTG's bill. I mean AOC's reaction to all the pushback has been hilarious in and of itself.

Are we simply not caring about anything that isn't directly Trump-related?

How boring.

I dont discuss politics at BF anymore.

Thats for idiots like you and Lily to gnaw the bone over.

 

[X]

What happened?

 

[Garraty_47]

I dont discuss politics at BF anymore.

Well aren't you the speshul little snowflake.
Want a gold star, or maybe a cookie?

Thats for idiots like you and Lily to gnaw the bone over.

Riiiiight.
Because I'm *all* about discussing politics at BF.
Constantly. Nothing but.

 

[Garraty_47]

What happened?

Nothing of note, apparently.

As you were.

 

[X]

Riiiiight.
Because I'm *all* about discussing politics at BF.
Constantly. Nothing but.

Correct

 

[Garraty_47]

Correct

Spoken like the kind of muttonhead who picks up a screwdriver and mumbles to himself "righty loosey, lefty tighty".

 

[LotusBud]

I thought for sure someone here would Share a clip or three of the news about AOC getting dragged by essentially everyone over her vote on MTG's bill. I mean AOC's reaction to all the pushback has been hilarious in and of itself.

Are we simply not caring about anything that isn't directly Trump-related?

How boring.

I don't now. I live in Europe, and the headlines here are different, so I have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[jack]

I don't now. I live in Europe, and the headlines here are different, so I have no idea what you're talking about.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

 

[LotusBud]

OK. I looked it up. Yes, I agree with AOC getting dragged. So there.

 

[Garraty_47]

I don't now. I live in Europe, and the headlines here are different, so I have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[Garraty_47]

OK. I looked it up. Yes, I agree with AOC getting dragged. So there.

I believe this kind of accountability for "the left" is absolutely necessary if anything is ever going to fundamentally change. "The left's" biggest enemy isn't the republicans... it's the corrupt gate-keeping democrats whose support for leftist policies is performative at best. If that gets me labeled 'rightwing' or a Trump supporter or whatever that's just too bad.

People who know me know better and people who don't know me can think whatever they want.

 

[LotusBud]

I believe this kind of accountability for "the left" is absolutely necessary if anything is ever going to fundamentally change. "The left's" biggest enemy isn't the republicans... it's the corrupt gate-keeping democrats whose support for leftist policies is performative at best. If that gets me labeled 'rightwing' or a Trump supporter or whatever that's just too bad.

People who know me know better and people who don't know me can think whatever they want.

Yes. But imo, nothing will ever change as long as third parties cannot win elections, no matter how much the Dems are held accountable. The Dems are a corporate, war mongering party, and they won't ever allow trues progressives to control the party.

But also, being a Trump apologist will NEVER help improve this mess. Trump is a monster. He's like the Id of the rightwing allowed to run amuck.

 

[X]

Spoken like the kind of muttonhead who picks up a screwdriver and mumbles to himself "righty loosey, lefty tighty".

How the fuck else are you supposed to know which way is which

 

[Garraty_47]

Yes. But imo, nothing will ever change as long as third parties cannot win elections, no matter how much the Dems are held accountable. The Dems are a corporate, war mongering party, and they won't ever allow trues progressives to control the party.

But also, being a Trump apologist will NEVER help improve this mess. Trump is a monster. He's like the Id of the rightwing allowed to run amuck.

And why do so many people, even people who consider themselves "progressive" or "on the left", still refuse to vote for third parties or independents? Because the democrats are still successful at fooling those people into voting for them.

That has to stop. A critical mass of 'vote blue no matter who' folks need to wake up to the reality that neither republicans nor democrats give any fucks about us. At all.

It's the only way.

 

[jack]

I was one of those and I rarely vote dem anymore.

 

[LotusBud]

And why do so many people, even people who consider themselves "progressive" or "on the left", still refuse to vote for third parties or independents? Because the democrats are still successful at fooling those people into voting for them.

That has to stop. A critical mass of 'vote blue no matter who' folks need to wake up to the reality that neither republicans nor democrats give any fucks about us. At all.

It's the only way.

They refuse to vote for them because they know they can't win, and the Dems take full advantage of this fact and scare people.

The ONLY solution: Ranked Choice Voting. Evidence: The NYC mayoral primaries, among others.

 

[Garraty_47]

They refuse to vote for them because they know they can't win, and the Dems take full advantage of this fact and scare people.

The ONLY solution: Ranked Choice Voting. Evidence: The NYC mayoral primaries, among others.

That's circular logic and only accomplishes perpetuating the system.

"I never vote 3rd party"
Why not?
"They never win"
Why not?
"Because I never vote for them"

Your position is that we should only vote for someone IF they are presented as having a clear path to victory but who makes that declaration? Who constructs the metrics that are used to declare someone "viable"?

It's the establishment, innit.
You think they'll ever show people how to vote the establishment out of power?

Fuck what people with a vested interest in sustaining the status quo have to say about it. Fuck doing what *they* say is reasonable or possible. They lie. Constantly. About everything.

People need to leave behind their herd mentality and their peasant mentality.

Do what's right BECAUSE it's right; not because it's popular or has been endorsed by a celebrity or has been spoon-fed to us nightly on the corporate infotainment channels.

Collectively it *will* make all the difference in the world.

 

[LotusBud]

That's circular logic and only accomplishes perpetuating the system.

"I never vote 3rd party"
Why not?
"They never win"
Why not?
"Because I never vote for them"

Your position is that we should only vote for someone IF they are presented as having a clear path to victory but who makes that declaration? Who constructs the metrics that are used to declare someone "viable"?

It's the establishment, innit.
You think they'll ever show people how to vote themselves out of power?

Fuck what people with a vested interest in sustaining the status quo have to say about it. Fuck doing what *they* say is reasonable or possible. They lie. Constantly. About everything.

People need to leave behind their herd mentality and their peasant mentality.

Do what's right BECAUSE it's right; not because it's popular or has been endorsed by a celebrity or has been spoon-fed to us nightly on the corporate infotainment channels.

Collectively it *will* make all the difference in the world.

Jesus fucking Christ. I didn't say that AT ALL. I said that's the logic the two-party system uses.

What I said was we need ranked choice voting so third party candidates can win. And I gave an example of its use in the real world.

 

[Garraty_47]

Jesus fucking Christ. I didn't say that AT ALL. I said that's the logic the two-party system uses.

What I said was we need ranked choice voting so third party candidates can win. And I gave an example of its use in the real world.

That's one way to improve things. We can't just wait and hope that ranked-choice becomes a thing nationwide because you *know* the duopoly will fight that and drag it out perpetually if they can.

Abandoning the duopoly is something we can do NOW that will have effects NOW.

It should've happened a long time ago.

 

[LotusBud]

That's one way to improve things. We can't just wait and hope that ranked-choice becomes a thing nationwide because you *know* the duopoly will fight that and drag it out perpetually if they can.

Abandoning the duopoly is something we can do NOW that will have effects NOW.

It should've happened a long time ago.

Dude, please stop accusing me of saying and believing things I neither said nor believe. And own it when you do it, for fuck's sake. Don't just skate over it.

 

[jack]

That's one way to improve things. We can't just wait and hope that ranked-choice becomes a thing nationwide because you *know* the duopoly will fight that and drag it out perpetually if they can.

Abandoning the duopoly is something we can do NOW that will have effects NOW.

It should've happened a long time ago.

The "duopoly" will need regime change to effectively allow ranked choice.

Look at maine's politics for a roadmap on how to make it work nationally.

Alaska as well.

 

[LotusBud]

Dude, please stop accusing me of saying and believing things I neither said nor believe. And own it when you do it, for fuck's sake. Don't just skate over it.

I'm serious, @Garraty_47. You do it all the time. You go ape over something I never fucking said, and then you never, ever own it. It's truly irritating.

 

[Garraty_47]

I'm serious, @Garraty_47. You do it all the time. You go ape over something I never fucking said, and then you never, ever own it. It's truly irritating.

I construct my responses to *specifically* address your comments.

If I'm wrong show me *how* I'm wrong instead of merely having a meltdown.

...not taking every little difference of opinion as a personal insult might be a good place to start.

 

[Admin.]

And why do so many people, even people who consider themselves "progressive" or "on the left", still refuse to vote for third parties or independents? Because the democrats are still successful at fooling those people into voting for them.

That has to stop. A critical mass of 'vote blue no matter who' folks need to wake up to the reality that neither republicans nor democrats give any fucks about us. At all.

It's the only way.

So far I haven’t seen a 3rd party candidate gather enough support to do anything but shave off points from one or another major candidate. One 3rd party candidate I recall Ralph Nader, probably opened the door for George W Bush over Gore, how did everyone like how that turned out?

 

[LotusBud]

I construct my responses to *specifically* address your comments.

If I'm wrong show me *how* I'm wrong instead of merely having a meltdown.

...not taking every little difference of opinion as a personal insult might be a good place to start.

Show you? Read my posts. When I tell you, over and over, that I am not a Democrat and I believe in 3rd party candidates, how do you get out of that that I'm being scared into voting for Dems? How? I CLEARLY said the two-party system uses fear mongering to keep people from voting for 3rd party candidates. I NEVER said i vote for Dems because of that. NEVER.

 

[Admin.]

I'm serious, @Garraty_47. You do it all the time. You go ape over something I never fucking said, and then you never, ever own it. It's truly irritating.

He’s very similar to Dove in that “tactic”

 

[jack]

So far I haven’t seen a 3rd party candidate gather enough support to do anything but shave off points from one or another major candidate. One 3rd party candidate I recall Ralph Nader, probably opened the door for George W Bush over Gore, how did everyone like how that turned out?

That's not whats being discussed.

That's why rank-choice is likely to work. It ignores the two party system while implementing the ability to have a third party candidate fairly compete.

 

[LotusBud]

He’s very similar to Dove in that “tactic”

It's bizarre. he attacks me even when I'm agreeing with him. He does it a lot.

 

[Garraty_47]

Show you? Read my posts. When I tell you, over and over, that I am not a Democrat and I believe in 3rd party candidates, how do you get out of that that I'm being scared into voting for Dems? How? I CLEARLY said the two-party system uses fear mongering to keep people from voting for 3rd party candidates. I NEVER said i vote for Dems because of that. NEVER.

I *was* talking in generalities when it related to how people vote in this country.

I never called YOU a democrat.

I did say a couple of your stances wouldn't be particularly helpful HERE IN THE USA in bringing down the current system and tried to explain why that was so HERE IN THE USA where such reforms are sorely needed.

You personalized it. You did that. Not me.