Is there a reason talk of politics gets so vitriolic?

[Blurt]

I’ve always wondered why folks work themselves up to a point where they’re fixing to murder each other over ideas.

And yet I remain convinced that civil discourse is still possible.

How ‘bout we use fewer “you” statements and more “I” statements? Maybe that’d help, no?

 

[Lily]

It is possible. I have them in real life all the time.

Some like to fight and know that insulting the values of others stirs things up.

 

[Blurt]

I do believe that people ought to fight for what they believe in.

But I also believe that battle needs to happen in the arena of the Rule of Law.

Respect for the Rule of Law is the core component not just of the American Experiment but of any stable democracy.

And yet there are dark forces swirling about, seeking to extinguish Enlightenment values.

I’m on guard, armed with kindness, compassion, human-heartedness, and an unshakeable devotion to the power of rational discourse.

 

[Lily]

I do believe that people ought to fight for what they believe in.

But I also believe that battle needs to happen in the arena of the Rule of Law.

Respect for the Rule of Law is the core component not just of the American Experiment but of any stable democracy.

And yet there are dark forces swirling about, seeking to extinguish Enlightenment values.

I’m on guard, armed with kindness, compassion, human-heartedness, and an unshakeable devotion to the power of rational discourse.

You're absolutely right. This sub is on the part of the forum that is dubbed "drama free zone".

If posters choose to act out, they will work their way to being disinvited. I will confer with @BF and/or other staff to determine where the lines are drawn. How many warnings, etc.

 

[Murdy]

I will say this…

I enjoy reading Lily and Gurk aka Reggie because they can maintain a level of respectability while making excellent political points debating. I feel intrigued reading their exchanges.

It’s the neanderthal knuckle dragging spamtardation I can do without.

 

[cw_]

*knuckle drags*

 

[Lily]

I will say this…

I enjoy reading Lily and Gurk aka Reggie because they can maintain a level of respectability while making excellent political points debating. I feel intrigued reading their exchanges.

It’s the neanderthal knuckle dragging spamtardation I can do without.

Thank you. Yeah, we get some snark in, but it's not nasty. At least I don't feel negative about the exchanges.

 

[Murdy]

Thank you. Yeah, we get some snark in, but it's not nasty. At least I don't feel negative about the exchanges.

Peaches was an ACE too…

God rest his soul.

 

[Lily]

Peaches was an ACE too…

God rest his soul.

Yes, his presence is missed. He was a good man.

 

[Krieg]

As long as one side of the political spectrum is convinced the other side is the downfall of humanity psychically manifested, you will not have a reasonable discourse.

As long as people refuse to "agree to disagree" and do not have agreed upon point of reference, an "Operational definition", you will not have a civil debate.

As long as people are lacking in shelter, food, and safety they will be less inclined to hearing about ideas, aspirations, or thoughts of the future.

Blazor and I had many private conversations discussing our points of view. Such discussion flow much better without an audience.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

I’ve always wondered why folks work themselves up to a point where they’re fixing to murder each other over ideas.

And yet I remain convinced that civil discourse is still possible.

How ‘bout we use fewer “you” statements and more “I” statements? Maybe that’d help, no?

With the advent & popularity of social media, politics has become the new sports. People boo & root for lord knows not what and follow blindly for community favor anything that brings them more e-friends & e-enemies in a frenzied lust for attention whoring to fill an empty soul because they use their extremeties to reach out & snap selfies rather than reaching out & actually touching the very real people around them.

The surreal > real to them. So fucking sad. But they may be young & confidence is not yet evident in them.

Social media itself is an oxymoron as media was never meant to be social, but simply an outlet & inlet in place in case in the course of living we don't take the time to literally GO SEE YOUR FUCKING FRIENDS AND FAMILY.

Hope this helps.

 

[wizer]

But they may be young & confidence is not yet evident in them.

The craziness regarding politics isn't limited to the young. My girlfriends entire family would go at it including her 80 year old father. Waste of time and energy.

 

[Cookie Monster]

*knuckle drags*

*Beats chest*

 

[The Prowler]

People get angry when they are arguing about points and ideas they firmly believe, but they do not really understand.

So they get frustrated when they cannot effectively justify their position.

And when they experience a good argument, cognitive dissonance can arise.

And this results in a strong urge to lash out.

Somehow they feel that calling their opponent a "Nazi racist psychopath!!!!" will ease their discomfort.
.
.
.
.
.
It does not.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

The craziness regarding politics isn't limited to the young. My girlfriends entire family would go at it including her 80 year old father. Waste of time and energy.

It's like arguing about points of teeth on a single spinnng cog of an infinite machine so big that none of us will ever live long enough to see the the entire fruition.

Life is short enough you should appreciate your differences lest we be clones rather than debating them ad nauseam

What makes us unique is that we are so different. It is an inherent strength. Can you spell diversity without diverse? Or did I just blow your fucking mind.

Damn skip.

 

[wizer]

Can you spell diversity without diverse?

You can't spell diversity even WITH diverse.

 

[Kirk]

I’ve always wondered why folks work themselves up to a point where they’re fixing to murder each other over ideas.

And yet I remain convinced that civil discourse is still possible.

How ‘bout we use fewer “you” statements and more “I” statements? Maybe that’d help, no?

The simple answer is most of these people are from the so called community.

 

[Reggie_Essent]

I will say this…

I enjoy reading Lily and Gurk aka Reggie because they can maintain a level of respectability while making excellent political points debating. I feel intrigued reading their exchanges.

It’s the neanderthal knuckle dragging spamtardation I can do without.

That's kind of you to say, Murdy. And that's because I like and respect Miss Lily most of the time ... except when neither of us do. This is often due to Miss Lily's intransigence when she pretends not to grasp the fundamental truths I will sometimes bestow when making a political point.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

You can't spell diversity even WITH diverse.

Why are proponents of diversity adverse to the diverse?

Kamino.

It's no Keno.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

The simple answer is most of these people are from the so called community.

It takes a village. Even to produce idiots.

 

[Reggie_Essent]

To the point of the OP, civil political discourse was bad enough in the Pre-Trump days - especially amongst the crowd that washed up here at Bastard Factory one way or another and caused all the recent stir of drama. Many of us have been arguing at each other for nearly 20 years.

But ever since Trump came down that elevator, it seems half the world has gone absolutely fucking mad with hate. From the political establishment and the unelected permanent bureaucracy here in the US, and even to the International Globalist interests in Europe and across the world. The utter hate and "resistance" to Trump has been an historical phenomenon that will be written about for centuries to come.

What is the source of that hate? I have my theories, but most of you wouldn't like them.

 

[Blurt]

I’m liking the tone in this thread.

Quite unusual for Bastard Factory.

I might have to deconstruct my preconceived notions.

 

[Lily]

To the point of the OP, civil political discourse was bad enough in the Pre-Trump days - especially amongst the crowd that washed up here at Bastard Factory one way or another and caused all the recent stir of drama. Many of us have been arguing at each other for nearly 20 years.

But ever since Trump came down that elevator, it seems half the world has gone absolutely fucking mad with hate. From the political establishment and the unelected permanent bureaucracy here in the US, and even to the International Globalist interests in Europe and across the world. The utter hate and "resistance" to Trump has been an historical phenomenon that will be written about for centuries to come.

What is the source of that hate? I have my theories, but most of you wouldn't like them.

I believe it got worse because it seems that progress has been reversed. The SCOTUS is the biggest problem in my opinion. It all happened because of Trump being a transactional individual. He has no core beliefs, he wanted the Christian vote.

What does he care about abortion, for example? His female relatives will always have access to the care they need.

 

[Reggie_Essent]

I believe it got worse because it seems that progress has been reversed. The SCOTUS is the biggest problem in my opinion. It all happened because of Trump being a transactional individual. He has no core beliefs, he wanted the Christian vote.

What does he care about abortion, for example? His female relatives will always have access to the care they need.

You're all over the place here. When you say "it seems that progress has been reversed," you fist have to define what you mean by "progress." If you're talking about the "progress" that Leftist Extremist Progressives are always going on about, that's not progress according to any standard definition of the word as I understand it, and from my viewpoint is more like "The Road to Tyranny."

As for SCOTUS, I find it interesting how Leftists love, love, love the high court when it's filled with ideologue filth like Soto Mayor or the ugly lesbian one, but as soon as decent and good constitutional constructionists and originalists gain a majority, all of a sudden the high court is bad, bad, bad.

No, you have to focus your reasoning much more tightly to explain the basis of your obsessive Trump Hate.

 

[Lily]

You're all over the place here. When you say "it seems that progress has been reversed," you fist have to define what you mean by "progress." If you're talking about the "progress" that Leftist Extremist Progressives are always going on about, that's not progress according to any standard definition of the word as I understand it, and from my viewpoint is more like "The Road to Tyranny."

As for SCOTUS, I find it interesting how Leftists love, love, love the high court when it's filled with ideologue filth like Soto Mayor or the ugly lesbian one, but as soon as decent and good constitutional constructionists and originalists gain a majority, all of a sudden the high court is bad, bad, bad.

No, you have to focus your reasoning much more tightly to explain the basis of your obsessive Trump Hate.

Trump is a bad man. Period.

I'm tired right now, but I'll get back to it. I don't believe in this idea of constitutional rigidity. The system was set up to maintain the status quo, the power of the dominant white male over everyone else.

 

[Reggie_Essent]

After 7 years of asking Trump Haters why they hate Trump, Lily encapsulates the entirety of the coherence of every single answer ever given to me for that question:

"Trump is a bad man. Period."

Nothing about how his policies were wrong or failed.

Just "Trump is a bad man. Period."

At least she didn't mention he's orange like a cheetoh and says mean things.

 

[Lily]

After 7 years of asking Trump Haters why they hate Trump, Lily encapsulates the entirety of the coherence of every single answer ever given to me for that question:

"Trump is a bad man. Period."

Nothing about how his policies were wrong or failed.

Just "Trump is a bad man. Period."

At least she didn't mention he's orange like a cheetoh and says mean things.

What you fail to recognize is that they were not HIS policies. He's an amoral if not immoral man. He was fascinated by the power and pomp. He doesn't give a crap about this country. He's vapid. He wants power and money. He's worth $1 billion more than when he came into office. He's a grifter.

He told people like you what you want to hear. Then people like you pulled the levers for R. How many of the people that he chose to appoint or hire have told us these very things? All Republicans. ALL

He didn't build the wall. Mexico certainly didn't pay for it. He added trillions to the deficit. He screwed the pooch on Covid. He made bigotry "cool again". He gave money back to people that certainly need it, the wealthy elite.

When I'm not tired, which I am, there's more.

 

[Reggie_Essent]

What you fail to recognize is that they were not HIS policies. He's an amoral if not immoral man. He was fascinated by the power and pomp. He doesn't give a crap about this country. He's vapid. He wants power and money. He's worth $1 billion more than when he came into office. He's a grifter.

He told people like you what you want to hear. Then people like you pulled the levers for R. How many of the people that he chose to appoint or hire have told us these very things? All Republicans. ALL

He didn't build the wall. Mexico certainly didn't pay for it. He added trillions to the deficit. He screwed the pooch on Covid. He made bigotry "cool again". He gave money back to people that certainly need it, the wealthy elite.

When I'm not tired, which I am, there's more.

See? Just more "Orange Man Bad."

In your first paragraph, you psychoanalyze a man you never met and assert you "know" what he thinks and what he wants, what his "morality" might be which is a laugh coming from a Leftist. These are things you've been told to believe about the man in the gaslit echoing chambers you visit to reinforce your belief structure.

In the second paragraph we come to the nugget that comes from the core of Trump Hate:

"He told people like you what you want to hear. Then people like you pulled the levers for R."

People like me?

And there we have reached the heart of the matter. I contend that it isn't so much Donald Trump the man you people hate. Trump is just a cipher for your organized hate. Who you really hate -- who you've been told to hate by your betters -- are the millions and millions of your fellow Americans who voted for and support Donald Trump.

Why do you hate people like me?

 

[Lily]

See? Just more "Orange Man Bad."

In your first paragraph, you psychoanalyze a man you never met and assert you "know" what he thinks and what he wants, what his "morality" might be which is a laugh coming from a Leftist. These are things you've been told to believe about the man in the gaslit echoing chambers you visit to reinforce your belief structure.

In the second paragraph we come to the nugget that comes from the core of Trump Hate:

"He told people like you what you want to hear. Then people like you pulled the levers for R."

People like me?

And there we have reached the heart of the matter. I contend that it isn't so much Donald Trump the man you people hate. Trump is just a cipher for your organized hate. Who you really hate -- who you've been told to hate by your betters -- are the millions and millions of your fellow Americans who voted for and support Donald Trump.

Why do you hate people like me?

I don't hate. You're being a snowflake.

You didn't address his policy failures.

 

[Reggie_Essent]

I don't hate. You're being a snowflake.

You didn't address his policy failures.

The only policy failure I can think of was his handling of the Covid and listening to Fauci.

Which do you think of a failures?

... I'm ote. Time for crash.