I was shown an EPA chart regarding hot temps

[Lily]

You're point is that human made global warming is a hoax...like Covid 19? Human activity does impact climate and has increased global temps. What has happened in the past over thousands and 10s of thousands of years is now happening in decades. If you can, explain it by natural, non-human created causes.

No, that's not my point. My point is that we should question everything and has been that for years.

I don't always pull one lever for everything. I also don't hate human beings like some people do. We are as much a part of evolution as any other creature on the planet.

And no, this planet doesn't always have changes that are tens of thousands of years old. You treat this planet like Rousseau perceived the indigenous people as the Noble savage. Innocent, naïve, totally natural...a caricature of what they were, it's condescending.

All it took was one meteor to hit the planet to catastrophically change it. This isn't a planet of rainbows and unicorn farts. It's the real world and nature is mighty.

 

[The New Holliday]

All it took was one meteor to hit the planet to catastrophically change it.

That's right, and all of the past extinctions, long and short term climate changes have explanations.
.. I'm asking for your explanation of the present one if it isn't influenced by human activity.

 

[Lily]

That's right, and all of the past extinctions, long and short term climate changes have explanations.
.. I'm asking for your explanation of the present one if it isn't influenced by human activity.

I didn't say it wasn't caused at all by humans. And it would be the same thing that caused warming after the little Ice Age. You do know there was warming during the medieval warm period 950-1300 AD...you know when the Vikings were farming in Greenland.

 

[The New Holliday]

I didn't say it wasn't caused at all by humans.

I gotta call goal post moval here. (shouldershruggingpalmsraiseed smiley)

 

[Garraty_47]

Conflating weather with climate, especially with one on a global scale and the other on a regional scale, is not helpful.

Also:
If you want to know how trustworthy the EPA is just ask the folks in East Palestine, Ohio.

If all your sources are government sources you don't have any reliable sources.

 

[Lily]

I gotta call goal post moval here. (shouldershruggingpalmsraiseed smiley)

Interesting that you don't acknowledge the time period in the middle ages when Greenland was warm enough to farm.

 

[Lily]

Conflating weather with climate, especially with one on a global scale and the other on a regional scale, is not helpful.

Also:
If you want to know how trustworthy the EPA is just ask the folks in East Palestine, Ohio.

If all your sources are government sources you don't have any reliable sources.

This data runs counter to the permanent government's (bureaucrats) narrative.

 

[The New Holliday]

I didn't know I had to acknowledge ever ebb and flow?
But if I do then I would axe you to explain the current climate change in the absence of human activity. Oh, but I already did.
The changes after the last ice age major and minor are well in hand....and frankly the last little ice age was stopped by human activity.

Do yourself a favor and stop trying so hard to win...you won't.

 

[Lily]

I didn't know I had to acknowledge ever ebb and flow?
But if I do then I would axe you to explain the current climate change in the absence of human activity. Oh, but I already did.
The changes after the last ice age major and minor are well in hand....and frankly the last little ice age was stopped by human activity.

Do yourself a favor and stop trying so hard to win...you won't.

Well, I answered that with my own question. What made Greenland warm enough to farm when there was no industrialization?

Perhaps we don't fully understand these phenomena.

 

[The New Holliday]

Well, I answered that with my own question. What made Greenland warm enough to farm when there was no industrialization?

Perhaps we don't fully understand these phenomenon.

No, I do not accept your surrender.
I want you to explain the increase in temperature since the industrial revolution began in the absence of human made causes.
You started in the 1930s, and moved the goal posts back and back to where, 26K years ago or so.
Let's go back to that starting point. You ax't a question. Do you understand the answer that was given?

 

[Lily]

No, I do not accept your surrender.
I want you to explain the increase in temperature since the industrial revolution began in the absence of human made causes.
You started in the 1930s, and moved the goal posts back and back to where, 26K years ago or so.
Let's go back to that starting point. You ax't a question. Do you understand the answer that was given?

I'm not surrendering. I don't have to provide an explanation any more than you choose not to provide an explanation for a warming period that started around 900-1000 years ago, do I?

How is it that you understand the little ice age, and the ensuing warm up, was 26K years ago? I haven't gone back 26k years. It was about 1000 years ago, before industrialization.

Industrialization is an easy answer for the current warming. What explains warming 1000 years ago? That is more puzzling and inconvenient to your pat answer "BAD BAD HOOMANS".

 

[Garraty_47]

This data runs counter to the permanent government's (bureaucrats) narrative.

Cherry-picking data sets to produce an apparent anomaly, wildly extrapolating the anomaly to apply in a far broader context, then saying that anomaly invalidates all the other data isn't how science works.

Not even a little bit.

Oh- unless you're the EPA.
Then that's how science almost always works.

 

[The New Holliday]

"BAD BAD HOOMANS"

No, of course not. Humans have no impact on the Earth. They are insignificant little creatures.
Were the warming trends you are crying over due to human causes? No one thinks so.
Would you like to answer the question: what are the current increases due to if not human activity?

 

[Lily]

We can only work with the data that is available. Most, if not all, historical records were kept in a few countries. I can't speak to what happened or didn't happen globally when most countries were not keeping records.

 

[Lily]

No, of course not. Humans have no impact on the Earth. They are insignificant little creatures.
Were the warming trends you are crying over due to human causes? No one thinks so.
Would you like to answer the question: what are the current increases due to if not human activity?

I didn't say that either. Everything is simple with you, black or white.

Here are some of the factors that "scientists" have used to explain the little ice age.

"Several causes have been proposed:

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, heightened

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, changes in the

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, variations in

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and

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(

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), inherent variability in global climate, and decreases in the human population (such as from the massacres by

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,

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and the

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"

Funny how those things are considered relevant, sometimes.

 

[The New Holliday]

We can only work with the data that is available. Most, if not all, historical records were kept in a few countries. I can't speak to what happened or didn't happen globally when most countries were not keeping records.

We have pretty good records going back into the 1880s, but you may not have heard, there are actual methods which allow us to make good understanding of conditions going back many thousands and hundreds of thousands of years. Science much?

 

[The New Holliday]

Everything is simple with you, black or white.

Nothing is black and white with me - I'm totally "noir," so to speak.
You are flailing.
The reasons for the warm up you are upset about is under debate but not that it was caused by natural events.
What I will ask for the last time is:
What is the current warm up due to if not human causes.
...and - do you understand the causes of the 1930s temperature rise given the explanations given? (you know, given that that was the original question you posed)

 

[The Prowler]

"One interesting aspect of solar cycles is that the sun went through a period of near zero sunspot activity from about

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. This period of sunspot minima is called the Maunder Minimum. The "Little Ice Age" occurred over parts of Earth during the Maunder Minimum."

"Ultraviolet radiation increases dramatically during high sunspot activity, which can have a large effect on the Earth's atmosphere."

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[LotusBud]

Is that the united states only? Remember that the farming practices in the central US had impact on climate and soil erosion (the dustbowl).

The Google also:

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What caused the heatwave of the 1930s?

Poor land management (farming techniques) across the Plains furthered the impact of the drought, with lush wheat fields becoming barren waste lands. Without the vegetation and soil moisture, the Plains acted as a furnace. The climate of that region took on desert qualities, accentuating its capacity to produce heat.

Yes. I would be interested to see world wide stats from the 30s. Simply because this intensely hot weather is all over the planet now. It's going to be 85 degrees here today. And it's still March!

 

[LotusBud]

Right. However, in geologic time we've had warming and cooling...it's not unknown to the planet.

True, but Holliday is right. We need to see longer term assessments, and they need to be planetary, to make any kind of over-arching suggestions about what that 30s anomaly means.

 

[LotusBud]

Well, I answered that with my own question. What made Greenland warm enough to farm when there was no industrialization?

Perhaps we don't fully understand these phenomena.

That is always possible. Science is always evolving.

 

[LotusBud]

I didn't see this thread earlier, which is why I'm making all my posts now. But, anyway, there is this little bit:

But regional and global climate change are different things. Regional historic change has little bearing on the global events that are happening right now.

Not only was Greenland mostly covered in ice when Vikings settled there, but also the relatively warm conditions at the time were not a global phenomenon (fig. 1). This strongly contrasts with what we see today, with observed warming that is truly global in nature.

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[Lily]

I didn't see this thread earlier, which is why I'm making all my posts now. But, anyway, there is this little bit:

But regional and global climate change are different things. Regional historic change has little bearing on the global events that are happening right now.

Not only was Greenland mostly covered in ice when Vikings settled there, but also the relatively warm conditions at the time were not a global phenomenon (fig. 1). This strongly contrasts with what we see today, with observed warming that is truly global in nature.

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I found this study from 2019

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[LotusBud]

I found this study from 2019

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Yeah. Kind of what they said in the article I posted.