Jon Stewart on AI and workers

[LotusBud]

 

[Lily]

I saw it last night. What is going to happen to people?

They talk about how wonderful it's going to be. They will displace workers. This will completely finish off wrecking the economies of the world.

How can people buy anything, food, housing, utilities, etc with no money?

 

[LotusBud]

I saw it last night. What is going to happen to people?

They talk about how wonderful it's going to be. They will displace workers. This will completely finish off wrecking the economies of the world.

How can people buy anything, food, housing, utilities, etc with no money?

It's going to be a disaster of immense proportions.

 

[Murdy]

We have been warned about this….

 

[Garraty_47]

AI would be an incredible boon to a society that values human life.

We don't have one of those.

So yeah, it's going to fuck things up for everyone but the oligarchs and the professional managerial classes.

/shrug

Welcome to Earth.

 

[Lily]

AI would be an incredible boon to a society that values human life.

We don't have one of those.

So yeah, it's going to fuck things up for everyone but the oligarchs and the professional managerial classes.

/shrug

Welcome to Earth.

I ask this seriously. If we can't be the consumers that we've become, how will they profit?

 

[Murdy]

I ask this seriously. If we can't be the consumers that we've become, how will they profit?

Realistically, we could ALL be paid and let AI do all of the work…

But humanity is a bunch of haters and no one rides for free.

 

[Lily]

Realistically, we could ALL be paid and let AI do all of the work…

But humanity is a bunch of haters and no one rides for free.

We could. But they won't do that.

My bestie in LA is working for a company for 2 years now. Shitty benefits and his first year he got 3 days off vacation. This year he got a whole week off. Whoo whooo!

The vast majority of business owners, small and large, don't care about workers.

 

[Garraty_47]

I ask this seriously. If we can't be the consumers that we've become, how will they profit?

They only support the consumer model because workers need to have a semblance of a life or they won't work. An exploited labor/consumer pool is how they sustain their lifestyles *now* but it's not the only way it could be accomplished. Once machines can fully replace workers the owners/controllers won't require "the working classes" anymore. Machine labor will produce the goods and services they want and allow them continue existing wrapped in comfort and abundance.

Everyone else will be "useless eaters" and highly disposable.

 

[Lily]

They only support the consumer model because workers need to have a semblance of a life or they won't work. An exploited labor/consumer pool is how they sustain their lifestyles *now* but it's not the only way it could be accomplished. Once machines can fully replace workers the owners/controllers won't require "the working classes" anymore. Machine labor will produce the goods and services they want and allow them continue existing wrapped in comfort and abundance.

Everyone else will be "useless eaters" and highly disposable.

Who will they sell to? What will "trade" involve?

The global economy, whatever you think about it, is based on the exchange of goods. Someone has to be the end user, whether it's biofuels, tvs, computers, food, cars, etc.

What will be the "economy". I don't see it.

 

[Garraty_47]

Who will they sell to? What will "trade" involve?

The global economy, whatever you think about it, is based on the exchange of goods. Someone has to be the end user, whether it's biofuels, tvs, computers, food, cars, etc.

What will be the "economy". I don't see it.

If workers are removed from the equation but the goods and services are still being provided they won't *need* to pay anyone anything. Economies transform and shift constantly anyway; there's no reason to believe any effort will be spared to prolong a worker/consumer based economy just for what... nostalgia? Tradition?

The market will become trading whatever is in demand.
That means raw resources, certainly.
But beyond that? /shrug

It could be as simple as the best AI upgrades, although at some point the AI will be coding themselves I'm sure.

It might be anything that AI can't produce faster and more efficiently or, as a machine intelligence, is incapable of producing at all. Maybe it'll be experiences... who can construct the best theme park or virtual reality world.

The economy will be something we probably wouldn't even recognize *as* an economy, by today's standards, because it will have moved so far from the systems in place currently.

We can't even be sure if the new economy will happen organically or by the intent of those few in positions to shape such things and each scenario would no doubt have wildly divergent results.

All we can know is that based on conditions as they are now the vast majority of humans will be fucked unless they stand together and do something before it's too late, if it isn't already.

 

[Lily]

If workers are removed from the equation but the goods and services are still being provided they won't *need* to pay anyone anything. Economies transform and shift constantly anyway; there's no reason to believe any effort will be spared to prolong a worker/consumer based economy just for what... nostalgia? Tradition?

The market will become trading whatever is in demand.
That means raw resources, certainly.
But beyond that? /shrug

It could be as simple as the best AI upgrades, although at some point the AI will be coding themselves I'm sure.

It might be anything that AI can't produce faster and more efficiently or, as a machine intelligence, is incapable of producing at all. Maybe it'll be experiences... who can construct the best theme park or virtual reality world.

The economy will be something we probably wouldn't even recognize *as* an economy, by today's standards, because it will have moved so far from the systems in place currently.

We can't even be sure if the new economy will happen organically or by the intent of those few in positions to shape such things and each scenario would no doubt have wildly divergent results.

All we can know is that based on conditions as they are now the vast majority of humans will be fucked unless they stand together and do something before it's too late, if it isn't already.

You could be completely right. I am utterly baffled by what it would begin to look like. But there will be massive amounts of harm to regular people. Famines will be beyond our understanding of what a famine is to us now.

We are going to be fucked.

 

[Murdy]

We aren’t fucked. I refuse to go quietly.

 

[Lily]

We aren’t fucked. I refuse to go quietly.

I worry about my kids and their kids to be honest.

 

[Murdy]

I worry about my kids and their kids to be honest.

That will be my reason.

 

[The Prowler]

 

[cw_]

 

[Joe]

The trouble is tho @The Prowler ... even tho the wealthier countries have slowed their population growth, the people in Africa, Central Asia (Afghanistan) and Central America don't appear to be having fewer babies.

And the world population is still expected to reach 10 bil soon.

so, it'll be a world with increasing number of have nots from poorer nations, no doubt pounding on the doors wanting to get into the wealthier countries.

So the refugee problem will get worse

 

[The Prowler]

The trouble is tho @The Prowler ... even tho the wealthier countries have slowed their population growth, the people in Africa, Central Asia (Afghanistan) and Central America don't appear to be having fewer babies.

And the world population is still expected to reach 10 bil soon.

so, it'll be a world with increasing number of have nots from poorer nations, no doubt pounding on the doors wanting to get into the wealthier countries.

So the refugee problem will get worse

 

[LotusBud]

Who will they sell to? What will "trade" involve?

The global economy, whatever you think about it, is based on the exchange of goods. Someone has to be the end user, whether it's biofuels, tvs, computers, food, cars, etc.

What will be the "economy". I don't see it.

This is the part of the equation that I believe they choose to ignore. They tell themselves that there is always another market. Forget the US, the new market is China. Then they will move on to India. They don't understand that they will, indeed, run out of consumers if they keep this shit up. They think their billions will last forever so they don't worry. They don't understand that when the lives of all workers go to shit, their lives will also be destroyed.

 

[Garraty_47]

They don't understand that when the lives of all workers go to shit, their lives will also be destroyed.

True.
I vote we ensure it by welding shut the doors of their bunkers then pouring cement down their air shafts.

The last thing the world will ever need is them crawling out of their holes and starting this shit all over again.

 

[Murdy]

This is the part of the equation that I believe they choose to ignore. They tell themselves that there is always another market. Forget the US, the new market is China. Then they will move on to India. They don't understand that they will, indeed, run out of consumers if they keep this shit up. They think their billions will last forever so they don't worry. They don't understand that when the lives of all workers go to shit, their lives will also be destroyed.

The people outsourcing to these countries are the problem.

But how can anyone afford to do business in this country?

American’s no longer believe that if you work hard, you will be successful.

 

[LotusBud]

The people outsourcing to these countries are the problem.

But how can anyone afford to do business in this country?

American’s no longer believe that if you work hard, you will be successful.

Because it's just not true. Success is more about a willingness to be a greedy monster with zero morals than it is about working hard.

 

[Murdy]

Because it's just not true. Success is more about a willingness to be a greedy monster with zero morals than it is about working hard.

I think the best economics is when everyone looks out for each other not just themselves.

 

[LotusBud]

I'm going to San Bernardino ring-a-ding-ding
Milkshake mixers, that's my thing, now
These guys bought a heap of my stuff
And I gotta see a good thing sure enough, now
Or my name's not Kroc, that's Kroc with a 'k'
Like 'crocodile' but not spelt that way, yeah
It's dog eat dog, rat eat rat
Kroc-style boom, like that

The folks line up all down the street
And I'm seeing this girl devour her meat, now
And then I get it, wham, as clear as day
My pulse begins to hammer and I hear a voice say

These boys have got this down
Oughtta be a one of these in every town
These boys have got the touch
It's clean as a whistle and it don't cost much
Wham, bam you don't wait long
Shake, fries, patty, you're gone
And how about that friendly name?
Heck, every little thing oughtta stay the same
Or my name's not Kroc, that's Kroc with a 'k'
Like 'crocodile' but not spelt that way, now
It's dog eat dog, rat eat rat (x3)
Kroc-style boom, like that

You gentlemen ought to expand
You're going to need a helping hand, now
So, gentlemen, well, what about me?
We'll make a little business history, now
Or my name's not Kroc. Call me Ray
Like 'crocodile' but not spelt that way, now
It's dog eat dog, rat eat rat
Kroc-style, boom, like that

Well, we build it up and I buy 'em out
But man, they made me grind it out, now
They open up a new place flipping meat
So I do too, right across the street

I got the name, I need the town
They sell up in the end and it all shuts down
Sometimes you gotta be an s.o.b.
You want to make a dream reality
Competition? Send 'em south
If they're gonna drown
Put a hose in their mouth
Do not pass 'Go', go straight to hell
I smell that meat hook smell

Or my name's not Kroc, that's Kroc with a 'k'
Like 'crocodile' but not spelt that way, now
It's dog eat dog, rat eat rat (x3)
Kroc-style boom, like that.

 

[The Prowler]

 

[Garraty_47]

 

[The Prowler]

 

[Garraty_47]

 

[LotusBud]

Have you two hijacked my thread?