Is Dovey Pregnant?

[Omnipotent]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

 

[Lily]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

I didn't feel that her anger was unjustified.

When the pro life lobby on the other side doesn't find a compromise and starts criminalizing women over their choices, I feel they've been have done nothing to bend on the issue.

if they are pro-life, then they should devise a non destructive strategy to lower abortions, unwanted teenage pregnancies and programs to encourage women to keep their babies improve a mother's health. Free or subsidized daycare as well. Same time, it takes a lot of money and resources to have a birther society. However, many in the Republican party want lower taxes and to cut social services which would be incompatible with that scenario

so they are being unrealistic in their demands.

It's okay to be angry, you're right. It's best not to get lost in the anger though. Most Americans support abortion, it's about the cut off point that people are fighting about.

It's a wedge issue, Joe. 90% of abortions happen within the first trimester. Most of the rest are due to medical problems. This is a power grab over women, plain and simple.

 

[Lily]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I agree, America is becoming backwards.

 

[Joe]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

 

[Lily]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

The state doesn't support people in Mexico the way they do in the Western world. It's because of the inability to control the population growth that Mexico did.

I wouldn't be surprised that it's also due to medical tourism. Mexico also said that they'd provide abortions as needed to Americans with no other options.

 

[Omnipotent]

I think what I have been trying to say all along is only MY fertilised eggs belongs to ME and NOBODY else and I can do what I like with my fertilised egg. I cannot tell other people what they can do or not do with their fertilised eggs and nor should governments or courts.... omg.

Are they telling men what they can or cannot do with their sperm?

However, like most people once a healthy baby to a healthy mother to be enters the 3rd trimester I am extremely uncomfortable having that baby aborted. That is fair enough I feel. Fortunately that is very rare.

 

[Jeannie]

@Dove stop.

Can't reason with these leftist rodents.

its just these circular arguments that go nowhere

with leftist idiots that have 14 braincells between the 5 of them

they see the glass half full, we see it half empty (or visa versa)

its a drag

Plus they're a bunch of retards who can't debate a matter properly for shit

its like a cat chasing its tail, cute at first but cmon

 

[Omnipotent]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

What is worse... an unwanted pregnancy or an unwanted child?

The doveys and Biggie Smiles of our generation do not know the ramifications of a deluge of unwanted children I should think. Because they lived through an age, unwanted pregnancies have been dealt safely with.

It is better with fewer children who get better quality care than a whole pile of unwanted starving neglected children.

Unwanted children are cruelly neglected and that is so sad to me and others to see little kids suffer.

 

[Jeannie]

life is when a fetus can survive on its own, and if a mother cant figure it out by that time and she seeks an abortion, toss m both in the bin

 

[Joe]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

What is worse... an unwanted pregnancy or an unwanted child?

The doveys and Biggie Smiles of our generation do not know the ramifications of a deluge of unwanted children I should think. Because they lived through an age, unwanted pregnancies have been dealt safely with.

It is better with fewer children who get better quality care than a whole pile of unwanted starving neglected children.

Unwanted children are cruelly neglected and that is so sad to me and others to see little kids suffer.

I seem to remember this young girl who worked at this store in my neighborhood who got pregnant and I heard this female co-worker tell her it would all work out and be OK.So..I saw her months later walking on the street with her new child and she looked so unhappy and burnt out. She aged very quickly I recall. This once perfect beauty withered up like a shrunken flower.

Anyways, that's why I'd never advise either way...to keep or abort.

I don't wanna be blamed for whatever choice a woman/girl makes.

And I think that's the way most men feel.

We don't wanna end up as the villain.

Just let them decide. Better yet if like in that case it's another woman who gave her the advice so they can't claim that it's men who control the abortion or birthing debate.

 

[Omnipotent]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

Can you envision a time when they'll ban American women from crossing the border into Mexico or demanding proof they aren't pregnant before allowing them through? It is like the Handmaidens Tale. It is a grizzly scenario and life does really follow art.

 

[Jeannie]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

 

[Joe]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

Can you envision a time when they'll ban American women from crossing the border into Mexico or demanding proof they aren't pregnant before allowing them through? It is like the Handmaidens Tale. It is a grizzly scenario and life does really follow art.

Yes, I can. There'll probably be a testing center and a hardline Republican administration will coerce Mexico with economic sanctions to report them.

 

[Joe]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

 

[Jeannie]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

ughhh... i cant watch more than 5 secs

whens he getting voted out?

 

[Omnipotent]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

What is worse... an unwanted pregnancy or an unwanted child?

The doveys and Biggie Smiles of our generation do not know the ramifications of a deluge of unwanted children I should think. Because they lived through an age, unwanted pregnancies have been dealt safely with.

It is better with fewer children who get better quality care than a whole pile of unwanted starving neglected children.

Unwanted children are cruelly neglected and that is so sad to me and others to see little kids suffer.

I seem to remember this young girl who worked at this store in my neighborhood who got pregnant and I heard this female co-worker tell her it would all work out and be OK.So..I saw her months later walking on the street with her new child and she looked so unhappy and burnt out. She aged very quickly I recall. This once perfect beauty withered up like a shrunken flower.

Anyways, that's why I'd never advise either way...to keep or abort.

I don't wanna be blamed for whatever choice a woman/girl makes.

And I think that's the way most men feel.

We don't wanna end up as the villain.

Just let them decide. Better yet if like in that case it's another woman who gave her the advice so they can't claim that it's men who control the abortion or birthing debate.

Women absolutely advise other girls in trouble what to do. They have more say than men actually. Motherhood is a female condition and problem and joy too.... it is all those things but people who are flat broke really struggle so it depends how rich you are. Remember I was an unmarried mother for the 1st 8 years of my son's life however I had a well off family so nothing bad was going to happen to me but I know others who were not so well off and their children were brought up in extreme poverty and that is diabolical.

 

[Omnipotent]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

I love your posts. Don't stop talking about subjects you want to discuss. You're doing a good job adding another point of view.

 

[Joe]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

ughhh... i cant watch more than 5 secs

whens he getting voted out?

Actually, I think it's time for him to go.

and I even voted for him a few times.

But I think once he and his party are gone, it won't be an easy time in the country.

Cuz what'll likely to succeed him and them are a hardline Conservative government that will slash the budgets due to the debt that was built up during the Trudeau years.

The honeymoon will be over.

 

[Jeannie]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

ughhh... i cant watch more than 5 secs

whens he getting voted out?

Actually, I think it's time for him to go.

and I even voted for him a few times.

But I think once he and his party are gone, it won't be an easy time in the country.

Cuz what'll likely to succeed him and them are a hardline Conservative government that will slash the budgets due to the debt that was built up during the Trudeau years.

The honeymoon will be over.

trudope and the POTATUS.. dark days

 

[Dove]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

What is worse... an unwanted pregnancy or an unwanted child?

The doveys and Biggie Smiles of our generation do not know the ramifications of a deluge of unwanted children I should think. Because they lived through an age, unwanted pregnancies have been dealt safely with.

It is better with fewer children who get better quality care than a whole pile of unwanted starving neglected children.

Unwanted children are cruelly neglected and that is so sad to me and others to see little kids suffer.

Cas if every baby to be aborted this year was adopted out, we would still have people waiting to adopt.

I know you hate adoption but there is no such thing as an unwanted baby.

If abortion was banned/restricted....the rate of unwanted pregnancy would drop. A disturbing amount of people here view abortion as a last resort birth control option. As embarrassing as this is....people in the US are freaking out that this will destroy "hook up" culture.

 

[Joe]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

I love your posts. Don't stop talking about subjects you want to discuss. You're doing a good job adding another point of view.

The other thing I wanted to add...this ruling will only make relations between men & women -even on just a casual basis much worse. Kinda like when Donald Trump became President of the US. People scoffed at this T.D.S. - Trump Derangement Syndrome - but it was quite real. And it resulted in movements like #me too defining relationships between men & women. Which of course was nasty, vindictive & strained. Even in this country.

SO this post Roe era will be like that...to the power of 10. It not only sends back Women's rights a full century it does the same to male female relations. And we now have all these women angry at men blaming us because something has been taken away from them. All because of 1 USSC ruling & the agenda of some Texas Taliban -aka the Religious Right in the States.

 

[Biggie Smiles]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

In oregon tampons are a mans issue now too

they hand them out in boys bathrooms soo.....

 

[Omnipotent]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

What is worse... an unwanted pregnancy or an unwanted child?

The doveys and Biggie Smiles of our generation do not know the ramifications of a deluge of unwanted children I should think. Because they lived through an age, unwanted pregnancies have been dealt safely with.

It is better with fewer children who get better quality care than a whole pile of unwanted starving neglected children.

Unwanted children are cruelly neglected and that is so sad to me and others to see little kids suffer.

Cas if every baby to be aborted this year was adopted out, we would still have people waiting to adopt.

I know you hate adoption but there is no such thing as an unwanted baby.

If abortion was banned/restricted....the rate of unwanted pregnancy would drop. A disturbing amount of people here view abortion as a last resort birth control option. As embarrassing as this is....people in the US are freaking out that this will destroy "hook up" culture.

I absolutely hate adoption however I have a cousin out there I have never met because she was adopted out even after my mum said she would take her...

I am not opposed to OPEN adoption. Children need and deserve to know their real extended biological relatives. It is all very messy and complicated in today's world. I feel much heartache for lost souls who wonder who they really are.

I have to get on my pc and load a couple of pictures I took today.... BBL. I hate using my pc.... it's soooooo slowed down from Microsoft updates. Grrrrrr.

 

[Dove]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

I love your posts. Don't stop talking about subjects you want to discuss. You're doing a good job adding another point of view.

The other thing I wanted to add...this ruling will only make relations between men & women -even on just a casual basis much worse. Kinda like when Donald Trump became President of the US. People scoffed at this T.D.S. - Trump Derangement Syndrome - but it was quite real. And it resulted in movements like #me too defining relationships between men & women. Which of course was nasty, vindictive & strained. Even in this country.

SO this post Roe era will be like that...to the power of 10. It not only sends back Women's rights a full century it does the same to male female relations. And we now have all these women angry at men blaming us because something has been taken away from them. All because of 1 USSC ruling & the agenda of some Texas Taliban -aka the Religious Right in the States.

It pisses me off that you claim "women" when thousands of us resent your position and strongly disagree with it.

You arent talking about women. You are talking about a certain group of women.

I LOVE that bad ruling was overturned and I wouldnt date, do business, or trust a man who is opposed to the overturning of Roe.

Leftwing user men can enjoy the "sex strike" the rest of us call self control. We stopped fucking pro choice men years ago. Probably why you guys forget we exist.

 

[Dove]

On a scale of moron to stupid, where do you fall?

Care to actually address my post? Are you claiming that Blacks have lower rates of abortions than Whites do? Can you back that up with data?

Shes fucking stupid and hatefilled.

She thinks anything that helps black people and black families is white supremacy and we must help the black community by refusing to educate inner city children, disarming law abiding citizens so all the gang violence kills them off. Keep them poor. Keep them from getting an education and harvest their votes. Keep the violent ones out there and place an abortion mill every mile in minority areas.

Democrats are fighting "racism" they make up by killing off as many blacks as possible.

Kinda like what Canada has done to their indigenous people.

Y'know @Dove, the one thing I do resent about your invectives is that you accuse us men, particularly liberals as being the major supporters behind abortion and the abortion movement.

And yet..if you see the people who are demonstrating for the pro-choice movement, they are virtually all women, particularly young women in their 20s.

Y'know, men on the Left don't even want to tell women what to do.
Whether they should get an abortion or bear children.
The ones setting the narratives for their debate...are women.

I hardly see any men at their rallies.

For example:





I don't really wanna get involved with their politics or rationale.
In fact, I detach myself from their arguments.

My major concern is the need to address population control so that we as a species, regardless of our race, gender, nationality or age, can hold onto this planet a bit longer.

If not for ourselves, then future generations, including your daughters' who'll ultimately have to make the gut wrenching decisions that we have failed to make for them.

I can see some merits of your arguments/concerns.
ie - the destructive nature of abortions.

same time - how about getting serious about family planning and birth control so that there is much less of a need to resort to these measures?

ie - preventing unwanted pregnancies in teens?

measures to improve women's access to birth control and family planning

increased funding for violence/rape relief shelters

abolishing unfair laws which protect rapists and incestors in certain states?

providing monetary incentives to poor countries with excessive birth rates to bring their population growth rates down?

BTW, I don't just think the USA needs birth control and more family planning, the whole planet does just to save it.

You literally ignore everything that is shown to you.

And FYI? ALL the men wailing about Roe are PRO CHOICE.

I resent the fuck out you pretending the pro life movement isnt vastly female even after I've shown you over and over.

And I've addressed each of those points MORE then once and you just go on as if you didnt get any information at all.

It's seriously beyond frustrating.

No. That's not true.

I nor the vast majority of men who are pro choice, NEVER tell or advise women what they ought to think or do with respect to the abortion issue. As far as we're concerned, they own that issue.

At very worst and what you can accuse them of, is that they turn a blind eye to the issue, which I guess is condoning the practice.

However, there is no pressure from men who are pro choice on women to act.

Perhaps you experienced this, maybe this practice is prevelant in the sex industry which is a minority of incidents related to abortion. Otherwise, abortion from a pro choice pov is predominantly a woman's issue.

I clearly remember this book when it first came out:

My sister bought it in the early 70s, and it was lying around the house.

It was the Bible of the pro choice/abortionist movement.

Even men back then, men had nothing to do with that movement.

It was household names like Gloria Steinham and Germaine Greer. Susan Sontag?

They were the early leaders of that movement.

I have a really sad story to relate about a girl friend of mine called Ron, (now deceased).

Back in the 80s and after her 3rd boy was born by caesarian her husband knocked her up pretty much straight away. I went to visit her and she was crying .... she told me her doctor said she can't have another baby this close to 3 caesarians or she would die so it was recommended she terminate this 4th pregnancy.

She told me through tears she believed all babies came from God so aborting this baby was against her morals. Her husband Steve said to her he would stand by her with any decision she made and because it was life and death she had to choose abortion....

Later down the track, Rona had a daughter... so 3 boys and 1 girl....but I am never going to forget that poor distressed woman telling me her dilemma...

It was so so sad....

I feel like telling anti abortionists to just FUCK OFF because abortion issues are more than those people realise.

Actually @Omnipotent, can you verify or disprove Dovey's assertion that the pro choice movement is controlled by men or not? I'd like to hear your views on it. And while yer at it, maybe @Lily and @LotusBud can chime in with their views on Dove's claims.

I've never heard of incidents where men FORCED women to have abortions or bossed them around like that. Perhaps it happens, but I was under the impression that it was the other way around. That men boss women into having more babies.

What is the truth behind this issue?

I don't know enough about what happens in others' intimate relationships. I don't know how anyone would have enough information to make any such claims. Anecdotal data is nowhere near being definitive.

Every man that I have ever known has been pro-choice, but I'm from a liberal state. I won't assume that what I've experienced is the be all and end all of opinion on the movement and/or abortion. I know that women I know want to control their own bodies and not have Big Government in their wombs.

A literature review might provide insight, but I'm not going to spend my time entertaining nonsense from the nonsensical posters here at BF.

But pro choice men generally never, if ever tell women to have an abortion, right?

Or are they even involved in these movements at all or in charge of them?

There are 330 million people in the US, just about half of them men. Are there men that have forced a woman to have an abortion? I'm sure there have been. Does that make it common? I tend to hope not. It's also possible that some fundy Christian has forced a woman to have a baby she didn't want. I don't know though.

No one has ever been able to make me do jack shit that I don't want to do.

I'm more inclined to think if men take away the right to have abortions, they will get much more upset than if they grant this to them.

ie - this woman had an absolute meltdown when Roe vs Wade was overturned:




Unlike the commentators in the vide,I didn't find it funny, but rather sad as if something valuable had been taken from her.

Pro-choice advocates and supporters knew this was coming. I don't understand people freaking out. I was displeased, but not freaked out.

The pro-choice movement needs to put their energy into action, not reaction.

It is a slippery slope into being denied rights already fought hard for... look at places that have their rights stripped... Catholic sth American countries. Communist countries. China Russia, Afghanistan... as Lady C says... be careful what you wish for.

Look at the bigger picture.

I think some Latin American countries such as Mexico have legalized abortion which I suspect was due to men who walked away from their responsibilities. So of course the state was stuck paying the bill and all these unwanted children. And that's probably why they legalized the procedure

What is worse... an unwanted pregnancy or an unwanted child?

The doveys and Biggie Smiles of our generation do not know the ramifications of a deluge of unwanted children I should think. Because they lived through an age, unwanted pregnancies have been dealt safely with.

It is better with fewer children who get better quality care than a whole pile of unwanted starving neglected children.

Unwanted children are cruelly neglected and that is so sad to me and others to see little kids suffer.

Cas if every baby to be aborted this year was adopted out, we would still have people waiting to adopt.

I know you hate adoption but there is no such thing as an unwanted baby.

If abortion was banned/restricted....the rate of unwanted pregnancy would drop. A disturbing amount of people here view abortion as a last resort birth control option. As embarrassing as this is....people in the US are freaking out that this will destroy "hook up" culture.

I absolutely hate adoption however I have a cousin out there I have never met because she was adopted out even after my mum said she would take her...

I am not opposed to OPEN adoption. Children need and deserve to know their real extended biological relatives. It is all very messy and complicated in today's world. I feel much heartache for lost souls who wonder who they really are.

I have to get on my pc and load a couple of pictures I took today.... BBL. I hate using my pc.... it's soooooo slowed down from Microsoft updates. Grrrrrr.

Okay I agree with this. Thank you for clarifying your adoption stance. I thought you were pretty rigid on this but it wasnt something I was gonna call you out on on a public forum....mostly because I dont know if something personal happened and I do try to be careful on touchy topics.

Bit this makes so much more sense.

 

[Joe]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

I love your posts. Don't stop talking about subjects you want to discuss. You're doing a good job adding another point of view.

The other thing I wanted to add...this ruling will only make relations between men & women -even on just a casual basis much worse. Kinda like when Donald Trump became President of the US. People scoffed at this T.D.S. - Trump Derangement Syndrome - but it was quite real. And it resulted in movements like #me too defining relationships between men & women. Which of course was nasty, vindictive & strained. Even in this country.

SO this post Roe era will be like that...to the power of 10. It not only sends back Women's rights a full century it does the same to male female relations. And we now have all these women angry at men blaming us because something has been taken away from them. All because of 1 USSC ruling & the agenda of some Texas Taliban -aka the Religious Right in the States.

It pisses me off that you claim "women" when thousands of us resent your position and strongly disagree with it.

You arent talking about women. You are talking about a certain group of women.

I LOVE that bad ruling was overturned and I wouldnt date, do business, or trust a man who is opposed to the overturning of Roe.

Leftwing user men can enjoy the "sex strike" the rest of us call self control. We stopped fucking pro choice men years ago. Probably why you guys forget we exist.

Well who overturned R v Wade?

It was 4 men & 1 fundamentalist female.

3 females on your USSC voted against overturning it Dovey.

It was hardly men who upheld that ruling.

That's the reality. The majority of women support abortion in America.

Perhaps they are not your kinda women.

But they are the majority and are the primary movers and shakers behind the pro choice movement.

Men? Nada

 

[The Prowler]

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

When does his "somber lookin wife" show up, Senile @Joe?

 

[Biggie Smiles]

It pisses me off that you claim "women" when thousands of us resent your position and strongly disagree with it.

You arent talking about women. You are talking about a certain group of women.

I LOVE that bad ruling was overturned and I wouldnt date, do business, or trust a man who is opposed to the overturning of Roe.

Leftwing user men can enjoy the "sex strike" the rest of us call self control. We stopped fucking pro choice men years ago. Probably why you guys forget we exist.

In all fairness... how would the soyboy tard cuck beta males like admong and holidork know what women are unless they posses a degree in biology? And you know those types... they go to school to obtain degrees in queer dance and fairy arts

so there's that

 

[Dove]

tampons, abortion, basically any women issue.. @Joe is right there lol

yeah I guess I'll shut up. However I never commented on tampons.

That's def yer issue.

Just we get all yer American news here up in Canada 24/7.

so, it's pretty hard to tune it out.

Even the Prime Minister and his somber lookin wife chime in.

I love your posts. Don't stop talking about subjects you want to discuss. You're doing a good job adding another point of view.

The other thing I wanted to add...this ruling will only make relations between men & women -even on just a casual basis much worse. Kinda like when Donald Trump became President of the US. People scoffed at this T.D.S. - Trump Derangement Syndrome - but it was quite real. And it resulted in movements like #me too defining relationships between men & women. Which of course was nasty, vindictive & strained. Even in this country.

SO this post Roe era will be like that...to the power of 10. It not only sends back Women's rights a full century it does the same to male female relations. And we now have all these women angry at men blaming us because something has been taken away from them. All because of 1 USSC ruling & the agenda of some Texas Taliban -aka the Religious Right in the States.

It pisses me off that you claim "women" when thousands of us resent your position and strongly disagree with it.

You arent talking about women. You are talking about a certain group of women.

I LOVE that bad ruling was overturned and I wouldnt date, do business, or trust a man who is opposed to the overturning of Roe.

Leftwing user men can enjoy the "sex strike" the rest of us call self control. We stopped fucking pro choice men years ago. Probably why you guys forget we exist.

Well who overturned R v Wade?

It was 4 men & 1 fundamentalist female.

3 females on your USSC voted against overturning it Dovey.

It was hardly men who upheld that ruling.

That's the reality. The majority of women support abortion in America.

Perhaps they are not your kinda women.

But they are the majority and are the primary movers and shakers behind the pro choice movement.

Men? Nada

A SCOTUS did. Because the ruling was successfully challanged.

Do you know anything the case that challenged it?

You first go off saying this should be decided by the people. And you are opposed to Roe being overturned which does EXACTLY that.

Joe.....those female justices who didnt want it overturned wont even define what a woman IS. Are you serious?

Again, "WOMEN" are not some fucking monolith and when you use that language you are completely disregarding probably millions of women.

Say progressive women. Or pro choice women. Because female abortion opposition exists and its too large of a group for you to be able to say "women" as if we all want legal abortion.

I've already pointed out the pro abortion movement was started by MEN. They intentionally recruited the feminists in order to sell it. And the MAN who started it lived to regret it.

 

[Dove]

It pisses me off that you claim "women" when thousands of us resent your position and strongly disagree with it.

You arent talking about women. You are talking about a certain group of women.

I LOVE that bad ruling was overturned and I wouldnt date, do business, or trust a man who is opposed to the overturning of Roe.

Leftwing user men can enjoy the "sex strike" the rest of us call self control. We stopped fucking pro choice men years ago. Probably why you guys forget we exist.

In all fairness... how would the soyboy tard cuck beta males like admong and holidork know what women are unless they posses a degree in biology? And you know those types... they go to school to obtain degrees in queer dance and fairy arts

so there's that

I totally get it that they have no care and no compassion or empathy for all the women crushed by abortion.

But they could at least acknowledge we all exist and stop trying to speak for "women".